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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 10:33:17 GMT -5
*Well Kodiak, it appears that 1,000 pound BROWN BEAR vs SPANISH FIGHTING BULL is one of those topics we will simply have to agree to disagree on.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 10:35:24 GMT -5
Of course, both are a beast. That is why IMO its 50%.
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 10:37:06 GMT -5
1,000 pound brown bear face-off results according to brobear's opions ( number #30 ). Keep in mind - all fights are face-to-face combat. 1- any elephant species - elephant 100% 2- any rhinoceros species with the exception of Sumatran rhinoceros - rhino 100% 3- Hippopotamus - hippo 100% 4- Sumatran rhinoceros - bear 7 / rhino 3. 5- Elephant seal - seal 100% 6- Pacific walrus - walrus 9 / bear 1. 7- Atlantic walrus - 50/50. 8- Giraffe - 50/50. 9- Gaur / Yak / Cape Buffalo / Water Buffalo / Bison / Spanish Fighting Bull - 50/50. 10- All other domesticated bull bovines - bear 9 / bull 1. 11- Polar bear - polar bear 6 / brown bear 4. 12- 1,000+ pound crocodile ( on land )- 50% 13- Huge anaconda/python - 50% 14- Moose - 50% 15- Stallion horse ( king of a herd )- 50%
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 10:39:37 GMT -5
*Well Kodiak, it appears that 1,000 pound BROWN BEAR vs SPANISH FIGHTING BULL is one of those topics we will simply have to agree to disagree on. Well, lets just agree....to disagree, ha ha ha.
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Post by theundertaker45 on Nov 3, 2020 10:39:53 GMT -5
brobear The issue I have with the big wild bovines against a 1000lbs brown bear is the relative weight difference; when comparing it with a bull cape buffalo, the absolute weight difference would roughly be ~650lbs. That sounds like much much but in this heavyweight class it really isn't, the buffalo is 65% larger in terms of weight which would be the equivalent of a lioness hunting a wildebeest and even less than barren ground grizzlies hunting muskoxen in the Alaskan tundra. With this being said, I heavily doubt that a relatively immobile herbivore would fare well against a massive carnivoran not that much smaller relatively, I just can't picture it in my head it happening the majority of the time as a brown bear weighing ~1000lbs would operate at an absolute elite level of grappling prowess/strength (even his bite force would outclass that of the largest modern big cats).
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 10:51:36 GMT -5
It is my understanding that the most common method of a bear killing a bull or cow is with a bite to the back of its neck. Regardless of the tales of the bear breaking the bull's neck with a paw-strike. In any case, according to appearances ( I've see no real comparisons ) the bison appears to have the biggest neck.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 10:52:30 GMT -5
Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, you need to stop for a while and think good because you are losing your mind brobear. Even though the Atlantic walrus is smaller than the Pacific walrus, it still reaches weights of 1200 to 1500 kg (around 2600 to 3300 lbs). There is no way an 1000 lb bear is winning 100% of the time.
nammco.no/topics/atlantic-walrus/
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 10:52:38 GMT -5
*Well Kodiak, it appears that 1,000 pound BROWN BEAR vs SPANISH FIGHTING BULL is one of those topics we will simply have to agree to disagree on. Well, lets just agree....to disagree, ha ha ha.
50/50 seems reasonable.
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 10:55:42 GMT -5
Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, you need to stop for a while and think good because you are losing your mind brobear. Even though the Atlantic walrus is smaller than the Pacific walrus, it still reaches weights of 1200 to 1500 kg (around 2600 to 3300 lbs). There is no way an 1000 lb bear is winning 100% of the time.
nammco.no/topics/atlantic-walrus/ Yeah; but its a big caterpillar. No way this thing is going to wobble around and kill a half-ton brown bear.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 10:56:45 GMT -5
Well, lets just agree....to disagree, ha ha ha.
50/50 seems reasonable. It does, it really is reasonable. Without looking at the past statistics, Spanish fighting bull vs an 1000+ lbs brown bear, 50% sounds very reliable.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 11:01:37 GMT -5
Its still too large. In my list at page 5, i have the Bull walrus winning 70% of the time. Especially the Pacific subspecies. Polar bears barely go after the bulls.
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 11:07:28 GMT -5
Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, you need to stop for a while and think good because you are losing your mind brobear. Even though the Atlantic walrus is smaller than the Pacific walrus, it still reaches weights of 1200 to 1500 kg (around 2600 to 3300 lbs). There is no way an 1000 lb bear is winning 100% of the time.
nammco.no/topics/atlantic-walrus/ Ok; I was thinking 1200 to 1500 pounds ( I despise metric ). Most sources give a rough average of one-ton for a bull Atlantic walrus. But yeah - 50/50 sounds reasonable here too.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 11:18:33 GMT -5
Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, you need to stop for a while and think good because you are losing your mind brobear. Even though the Atlantic walrus is smaller than the Pacific walrus, it still reaches weights of 1200 to 1500 kg (around 2600 to 3300 lbs). There is no way an 1000 lb bear is winning 100% of the time.
nammco.no/topics/atlantic-walrus/ Ok; I was thinking 1200 to 1500 pounds ( I despise metric ). Most sources give a rough average of one-ton for a bull Atlantic walrus. But yeah - 50/50 sounds reasonable here too. Finally we are in agreement today. Yeah, for the Atlantic walrus, i would agree on 50%. For the Pacific one, i have it at 70% for the Pinniped.
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2020 13:40:03 GMT -5
In the opening post; I stated a 1,400 pound grizzly.- then I changed that to a 1,000 pound brown bear. Both were, as I look back, bad choices. A full grown Carpathian or Ussuri brown bear would weigh roughly 700 pounds. Larger than most inland brown bears but smaller than the coastal salmon-eaters. 700-pound brown bear versus: 1- any elephant species - elephant 100% 2- any rhinoceros species with the exception of Sumatran rhinoceros - rhino 100% 3- Hippopotamus - hippo 100% 4- Sumatran rhinoceros - bear 7 / rhino 3. 5- Elephant seal - seal 100% 6- Pacific walrus - walrus 100%. 7- Atlantic walrus - 50/50. 8- Giraffe - 50/50. 9- Gaur / Yak / Cape Buffalo / Water Buffalo / Bison / Spanish Fighting Bull - 50/50. 10- All other domesticated bull bovines - bear 9 / bull 1. 11- Polar bear - polar bear 100% 12- 1,000+ pound crocodile ( on land )- 50% 13- Huge anaconda/python - 50% 14- Moose - 50% 15- Stallion horse ( king of a herd )- 50% ( 5,6,7 ) a bear is too intelligent to continue in a fight he can't win if walking away is easily possible. So no kills here. However, the bear's retreat gives a win to the huge pinniped.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 13, 2020 15:36:29 GMT -5
Why bad choices? If we use a 700 lb brown bear we would have to do our lists all over again. 1400 lbs or 1000 lbs is a whole different deal than 700 lbs.
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2020 15:39:33 GMT -5
Why bad choices? If we use a 700 lb brown bear we would have to do our lists all over again. 1400 lbs or 1000 lbs is a whole different deal than 700 lbs. I went to do just that ( as you can see ) but frankly, I see no difference. A 700-pound brown bear is still a Beast.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 13, 2020 15:43:52 GMT -5
Yes of course he is still a beast although a 1400 lb brown bear would be double the beast. To be honest, i would have to revise my list again this time with a 700 lb brown bear. At first glance, i would think more animals would be added to my list or the odds of the existing ones would change a little. The smaller the bear the more chances for the other animals.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 13, 2020 15:55:47 GMT -5
You sure about this one brobear? A 700 lb brown bear vs a giraffe that weights between 2500 and 4200 lbs? 50%?
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2020 16:02:43 GMT -5
Where is that report you had found of the brown bear ( in Europe I believe ) that killed one or two bison?
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 13, 2020 16:10:49 GMT -5
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