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Post by theundertaker45 on Nov 3, 2020 11:54:07 GMT -5
Yeah, that was a brief summary of mine at that time; a 550lbs brown bear would bite slightly harder than a 375lbs tiger (just by a hunch).
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 12:29:18 GMT -5
King Kodiak A brown bear must have a weight advantage of ~40-45% in order to bite as hard as a tiger. Yes, so at average weights, the Ussuri brown bear has at least a 40% weight advantage over the Amur tiger. So at this point, the bear would start to have a higher bite force than the tiger. One less advantage for the tiger at average weights, lmao.
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2020 13:37:58 GMT -5
So, a typical male Amur tiger weighing 420 pounds compared with a typical Ussuri brown bear weighing 650 pounds; their bite force should match-up fairly equally. So, what would be the percentage of weight difference here?
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 3, 2020 14:39:45 GMT -5
So, a typical male Amur tiger weighing 420 pounds compared with a typical Ussuri brown bear weighing 650 pounds; their bite force should match-up fairly equally. So, what would be the percentage of weight difference here? 55%.
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Post by brobear on Nov 19, 2020 15:42:45 GMT -5
Cat claws Bear claws. www.softpaws.com/fascinating-facts-about-cat-claws/ Cats have claws that curve at the ends. This aids them in catching and holding onto prey and also in climbing. However, it adds to the risk of cats' nails getting stuck in items such as carpet loops and subsequently injuring their toes. *A tiger's claws can easily get hung-up in the tough leathery hide of the bear. The tiger's claws are designed for holding on and they make poor weapons. The claws of a brown bear are deigned for digging; even in near-concrete-hard earth riddled with rocks and tough tree roots. His claws are long, strongly rooted, and sharp enough. They can dig deep into the body of an adversary. Unlike the deeply-hooked claws of a cat, bear claws will not get themselves hung-up in tough hide or in a thick tangle of hair, which can distract the cat from the fight while attempting to free himself.
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Post by brobear on Dec 21, 2020 5:22:50 GMT -5
Concerning brown bear durability. When the early pioneers first began to explore the American West, such as Lewis and Clark, they went armed with the same longrifles as were adequate for hunting and fighting in the East. However, the these explorers discovered the grizzly, they quickly found out that they needed bigger ( more powerful ) guns. The low-caliber rifles had a problem with sending the soft lead ball into the thick body of a grizzly. He was so well armored with hair and a thick layer of muscle, that the rifle ball seldom found a vital organ. I have never read of any such problems ( historically ) with the shooting of lions and tigers. Also note, as recorded with the tiger Dale, even a large female brown bear might have enough muscle on her neck to prevent a sudden quick kill by a tigers bite at the base of her skull. Though with these she-bears, there was obvious serious damage done. The full-grown male brown bear has a neck girth greater than the girth of his skull, making a quick kill by a tiger impossible.
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Post by brobear on Jan 4, 2021 7:14:16 GMT -5
Taking the time to comprehend and understand the views and points made by the big cat enthusiast by taking a close in-depth look at some of their more common arguments. 1- Cats are natural-born killers; expert assassins. *This is true. The big cats have roughly 60-million years of ambush predator evolution giving them the natural killer instinct. Their methods are precise and effective. 2- A big cat has longer canines and pound-for-pound stronger jaws. *This is true. 3- The big cat has the advantages of speed and agility over a bear. The cat should then be able to get in the first bite. *This would seem logical. However, the big cat rarely uses his jaws in a fight until he has wrestled his opponent to the ground. Against a bear, this will take some doing. However, a bear bites and bites often while fighting. 4- If a lion or a tiger can kill a 2000-pound buffalo, then he can kill a 2000-pound bear. *To a novice, this sounds logical. But a bear does not stand with four hoofs planted in the dirt. He fights with the same basic weapons as the big cat; teeth and claws. *Edit and add: going back to number #1; Big cats are natural-born-killers. But exactly how would a big cat kill a full-grown male brown bear? It is a well-known fact that a tiger always kills a bear with a bite to the back of the neck at the base of the skull; thus breaking the spine. But, the boar brown bear's neck is too thick for the tiger to make such a quick kill possible. The tiger's only other option is to grab the bear by his throat. But, it is highly unlikely that a big cat would even attempt to go between those two huge arms to get to the bear's throat. But, even if this was accomplished, the tiger is not assured a victory. Strangulation is time consuming. For a big cat to strangle a buffalo to death can take anywhere from ten-minutes to half an hour. During this time, a brown bear will not remain still like a bovine.
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on May 30, 2021 5:12:55 GMT -5
/\ That is some serious injury especially on the first picture. A whole flap of skin being torn off must be extremely painful.
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Post by King Kodiak on May 30, 2021 18:32:13 GMT -5
/\ That is some serious injury especially on the first picture. A whole flap of skin being torn off must be extremely painful. People talk about feline claws, maybe am wrong, but i have never seen damage done by feline claws like those pics above, especially the first one. And those are just bears, we have already seen what bear claws can do to cars and trucks. Its clear that bears claws can do much more damage than feline claws. Feline claws are designed to grasp and hold.
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Post by Montezuma on May 30, 2021 18:44:20 GMT -5
/\ That is some serious injury especially on the first picture. A whole flap of skin being torn off must be extremely painful. People talk about feline claws, maybe am wrong, but i have never seen damage done by feline claws like those pics above, especially the first one. And those are just bears, we have already seen what bear claws can do to cars and trucks. Its clear that bears claws can do much more damage than feline claws. Feline claws are designed to grasp and hold.I think that cat's claws are for grasping and holding while the bear's claws are function depend on the bear like, Polar bear, to grasp prey and walk on ice Brown bear, digging and cutting Black bears, climbing and cutting Sloth bears, digging and cutting Sun bears, cutting and climbing Spectacled bears, cutting and climbing Gaint panda, i do not know These are just that i think. May be i am wrong or not.
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Post by King Kodiak on May 30, 2021 18:57:49 GMT -5
Each animal has its claws designed for different purposes. So, as to a face to face fight is concerned, which claw is more useful? A long sledge hammer or a small pocket knife? Also, if bear claws would be "that dull" as tiger boys claim, than the damage you see above could not have been done.
For face-off fighting:
Bear claws> feline claws
Simple.
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Post by tom on May 30, 2021 20:03:04 GMT -5
People talk about feline claws, maybe am wrong, but i have never seen damage done by feline claws like those pics above, especially the first one. And those are just bears, we have already seen what bear claws can do to cars and trucks. Its clear that bears claws can do much more damage than feline claws. Feline claws are designed to grasp and hold. I think that cat's claws are for grasping and holding while the bear's claws are function depend on the bear like, Polar bear, to grasp prey and walk on ice Brown bear, digging and cutting Black bears, climbing and cutting Sloth bears, digging and cutting Sun bears, cutting and climbing Spectacled bears, cutting and climbing Gaint panda, i do not know These are just that i think. May be i am wrong or not. NO you are not wrong. You pretty much nailed the differences to a T. All one has to do is witness some of the devastation as the result of 3-4 inch claws with the power behind those claws.
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Post by Montezuma on May 30, 2021 20:38:41 GMT -5
To be honest, i have never seen cats mostly with such injuries as these bears have except lion. Injuries that lion get are more fatal. Bears who fight for the best salmon spot can mostly be vicious but not deadly. Lions fight to death mostly.
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Post by tom on May 30, 2021 21:01:51 GMT -5
As Kodiak pointed out the claws from a Bear are much different than a Big Cat and have entirely two different purposes. Those horrific slashing type injuries you see on those pictures above really tell the tale on how devastating a weapon they really can be. A Lion IMO would not be capable of inflicting such wounds with it's claws.
As far as fighting to the death I think it depends on the situation. Not all Lion fights are to the death. An exception may be a couple pride males fighting and killing a single intruder to the pride. But probably just as common or even more so a single dominant male Lion (maybe larger) drives off the intruder after a fight until one day he (dominant male) succumbs to aging and he himself is driven off. I think much the same could be said about Bears especially Brown Bears and even more specifically the coastal Brown Bears of Alaska. A fight to the death is not all too common. One Bear usually the challenger, finds he's in over his head and retreats.
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on May 30, 2021 21:53:03 GMT -5
/\ That is some serious injury especially on the first picture. A whole flap of skin being torn off must be extremely painful. People talk about feline claws, maybe am wrong, but i have never seen damage done by feline claws like those pics above, especially the first one. And those are just bears, we have already seen what bear claws can do to cars and trucks. Its clear that bears claws can do much more damage than feline claws. Feline claws are designed to grasp and hold. carnivora.net/feline-claw-damage-thread-t3033.html#p7665Here is one where a lion’s claws are doing more than just holding. I do agree that both a brown bear and polar bear would be able to dig deeper than any big cat.
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Post by King Kodiak on May 30, 2021 23:10:46 GMT -5
So that damage to the zebra was done by the claws of the lion? Awesome that is alot of damage. But still, no trucks or cars are being destroyed by felines.
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Post by Montezuma on May 30, 2021 23:28:03 GMT -5
So that damage to the zebra was done by the claws of the lion? Awesome that is alot of damage. But still, no trucks or cars are being destroyed by felines. I think that bear claws are also thicker and stronger than those of big cats. Of big cats try to damage trucks or car so they could no as their claws are not much strong to inflict damage with force.
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Post by brobear on May 31, 2021 10:59:04 GMT -5
CLAWS. Anyone who has ever owned a house cat knows that hardly a day goes by that the cat gets himself hung-up in a piece of furniture such as a cushioned chair or couch. His deeply curved claws are designed to cling to a prey animal's hide and to pull said animal down. Those claws can get hung-up in the tough hide of an adversary. A brown bear's claws are designed for digging into ( often ) very hard ground. Those claws are strong and can do considerable damage. A brown bear's claws do not get hung-up in tough hides or other surfaces.
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Post by brobear on Jun 5, 2021 9:00:04 GMT -5
The face of the tiger is better designed for a "boxing match". His rounded muzzle is less likely to breakage than the dog-like muzzle of a bear.
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