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Post by King Kodiak on Sept 11, 2020 23:30:56 GMT -5
Ok, so up to now, the largest skull that we have on record for a modern bear is actually from an Alaska Peninsula grizzly. The largest Kodiak bear skull we have is from the Boone and Crockett club. But up to now, Ursus arctos Gyas is at the lead:
Alaska Peninsula grizzly:
(Credited to TheUndertaker45)
domainofthebears.proboards.com/post/28981/thread
Length-18.62 inches (473 mm) Width- 12.24 inches (311 mm)
SCORE: 30.86 inches
Kodiak bear (Boone and Crockett)
Length-17 15/16 inches (455 mm) Width- 12 13/16 inches (325 mm)
SCORE: 30 12/16 (30.75 inches)
Alaska Peninsula grizzly (Boone and Crockett)
Length-19 13/16 inches (503 mm) Width- 10 10/16 inches (270 mm)
SCORE: 30 7/16 inches (30.43 inches)
Polar bear (boone and Crockett)
Length- 18 8/16 inches (470 mm) Width- 11 7/16 inches (290 mm)
SCORE: 29 15/16 (29.93 inches)
So the Alaska Peninsula grizzly has the longest skull, while the Kodiak bear has the widest skull. The overall largest skull belongs to the Alaska peninsula grizzly followed by the Kodiak bear.
The score is the length + the width:
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SKULLs
Sept 12, 2020 1:14:10 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Sept 12, 2020 1:14:10 GMT -5
Those grizzlies that followed the bison herds, mostly scavenging wolf kills and bison dying from other natural causes, were larger than the Rocky Mountain grizzlies. This fact was told in several of the books I read about the "historic grizzly". But, even back then, the Kodiak bears were pretty-much just as they are now. Same diet. I'll try to find the source ( somewhere with this maze ) where a man studying the grizzly during the "outlaw grizzly days" had collected the data from every known grizzly actually weighed ( prairie grizzly ) and stated an average weight of 850 pounds. That would be halfway between the size of an Ussuri bear and a Kodiak bear.
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SKULLs
Sept 12, 2020 1:18:14 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Sept 12, 2020 1:18:14 GMT -5
The Grizzly Book by Jack Samson - page 241 - The Big Skull by Grancel Fitz. In the case of bears, it wasn't hard to find. The world's record grizzly skull is in the National Museum in Washington. The measurements of skulls give us the only accurate basis for comparison, and it is worth noting that this one was inaccurately reported for the last edition of the records. When the figures were found to vary from those on the same bear in earlier editions, the Washington authorities made a careful recheck. The length of that skull is 16 inches. The width is 9 and nine sixteenths. Combining these gives the record "score" of 25 and nine sixteenths. But far more important is the fact that this bear was shot near the Missouri River in Montana, away back in 1890, and it is highly significant that E.S. Cameron bagged him as early as the 4th of April. Since bears live for 40 years or more, unless somebody shoots them, and since they keep on getting bigger until they die, it is a fairly safe bet that this old monster was born in the great days of the bison, at least a century ago. With the passing of the bison and the settling of the plains, all this was changed. Those huge old buffalo-eaters turned to killing cattle, and were wiped out by the ranchers. The grizzlies that survived were in the high mountain country, where the heavy snows and lack of winter feed forced them to hibernate for as much as six or seven months of the year. If a bear can eat only half of his life, and has to sleep throughout the rest, it just doesn't make sense that he can ever grow as big as one who is out and eating well for nine months, and hibernates for only three. Here is an article on this skull.
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SKULLs
Sept 12, 2020 1:32:13 GMT -5
Post by King Kodiak on Sept 12, 2020 1:32:13 GMT -5
Yeah, that is a large skull, but its still nowhere near as the record skulls listed in reply #58. Even the interior grizzly skull from Boone and Crockett had a score of 27 13/16 .
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SKULLs
Sept 12, 2020 2:07:57 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Sept 12, 2020 2:07:57 GMT -5
I have been searching for the article written by one of the leading expert on bears during his time. Maybe Enos A. Mills or W.P. Hubbard. Where he tells of the weighing of the prairie grizzlies; and states that he came to the conclusion that the average of those old grizzlies weighed 850 pounds. He also added that his estimation was based on actual bears weighed and was not an exaggeration. In the brown bear section, I scanned through the topics Size, Historical Grizzly, and Man Meets Grizzly. I probably simply missed seeing it. *Edit and add; one cannot determine the size of a bear by the size of its skull or by the size of footprints.
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SKULLs
Oct 15, 2020 8:37:17 GMT -5
Post by King Kodiak on Oct 15, 2020 8:37:17 GMT -5
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SKULLs
Oct 15, 2020 8:50:34 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Oct 15, 2020 8:50:34 GMT -5
www.boone-crockett.org/bgRecords/WorldRecordsDetail.asp?area=bgRecords&type=SKULLS WORLD'S RECORDS BLACK BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 14 12/16 Greatest width of skull: 8 14/16 SCORE: 23 10/16 WORLD'S RECORDS GRIZZLY BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 17 4/16 Greatest width of skull: 10 9/16 SCORE: 27 13/16 WORLD'S RECORDS ALASKA BROWN BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 17 15/16 Greatest width of skull: 12 13/16 SCORE: 30 12/16 WORLD'S RECORDS POLAR BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 18 8/16 Greatest width of skull: 11 7/16 SCORE: 29 15/16 Kamchatka brown bear - SCORE 28 12/16. *I noticed that all of the Kamchatka bears are from the 21st century.
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Post by King Kodiak on Oct 15, 2020 8:57:35 GMT -5
Yeah thats true. Good observation. All of Boone and Crocket's bears are from the 50's, 60's and 70's.
Dont get confused though, what i just posted is from Safari club international. What you posted is from Boone and Crocket which does not seem to have Kamchatka brown bears
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Post by King Kodiak on Oct 24, 2020 15:40:03 GMT -5
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 24, 2020 18:06:01 GMT -5
Good skull comparison. The dinosaur skull looks like that of a duckbilled dinosaur.
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Post by King Kodiak on Oct 28, 2020 18:00:21 GMT -5
TOP TO BOTTOM
KODIAK POLAR AMERICAN BLACK.
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SKULLs
Oct 28, 2020 18:36:12 GMT -5
Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 28, 2020 18:36:12 GMT -5
The Kodiak bear has the strongest and most robust skull. The polar bear’s skull is still larger and stronger than that of the American black bear.
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SKULLs
Nov 1, 2020 0:43:04 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Nov 1, 2020 0:43:04 GMT -5
The record short-faced bear skull, from the biggest Arctodus simus specimen ever discovered, measures 20.51 inches. The record brown bear skull, that of a Kodiak, measures 19 and thirteen sixteeths inches long. The length difference is less than one inch. However, the short-faced bear had a much heavier skull.
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SKULLs
Nov 1, 2020 0:59:19 GMT -5
Post by King Kodiak on Nov 1, 2020 0:59:19 GMT -5
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Post by brobear on Nov 1, 2020 1:15:57 GMT -5
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SKULLs
Nov 1, 2020 1:18:31 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Nov 1, 2020 1:18:31 GMT -5
Remember too that the record score is a combination of both length and width of a skull.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 1, 2020 1:25:59 GMT -5
Reply #72: that chart is from Boone and Crocket also. that skull with a length of 19 13/16 inches was taken from Port Heiden, Alaska, that would make it from an Alaska Peninsula brown bear:
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 1, 2020 1:37:52 GMT -5
Good find brobear. So that would be the skull with the greatest length that we have, even surpassing the record Alaska Peninsula bear skull which measured 18.62 inches. The problem with that skull is the width, its 10 10/16, not the widest skull around, that is why the total score is 30 7/16.
The overall largest skull (modern bears) that we have up to now belongs to another Peninsula brown bear (found by TheUndertaker), that had a length of 18.62 inches, and a width of 12.24 inches. That one should have the highest total score up to now, 30.86 inches.
domainofthebears.proboards.com/post/36012/thread
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 1, 2020 11:20:39 GMT -5
So far, the skull with the greatest length in history belongs to the cave bear (Ursus Ingressus/Ursus Kanivetz) with 57.14 cm (571.4 mm)
Score: 32.55 inches.
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Post by theundertaker45 on Nov 1, 2020 11:40:27 GMT -5
King Kodiak The record skull from brobear's list has a score of ~30.75 inches; the largest skull from the collection that I have posted would come in at ~30.86 inches.
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