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Post by brobear on Aug 18, 2022 8:41:41 GMT -5
Shortridge says: "I'm unsure who's bigger between Indian sloth bear boars and Syrian brown bear boars, but the biggest male leopards can definitely take on both the males (not at the same time obviously) unless the boars are very large. When average-sized or below they can be beaten." *The size of the Syrian brown bear remains unclear. Perhaps he is roughly the size of an Indian sloth bear or maybe the size of a moon bear. How many reports do we have of a full-grown brown bear, of any subspecies, killed by a leopard? *IMO, not even the biggest leopard is willingly going to challenge a boar bear of any species face-to-face. Even a boar sun bear would be a difficult challenge for even a large leopard. All cats are hard-wired ambush predators and no cat, not even a lion, relishes going face-to-face against an adversary.
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Post by brobear on Aug 18, 2022 11:47:30 GMT -5
According to what we have to go on: www.bearconservation.org.uk/syrian-brown-bear/ ...the Syrian brown bear averages 250kg or 551 pounds and is the smallest brown bear subspecies. If the number is correct, then I highly doubt that the Syrian brown bear is the smallest brown bear subspecies.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2022 17:43:57 GMT -5
brobear No reports but the same applies vice versa in terms of the Syrian brown bear. There's no reason for a leopard to challenge a bear unless the size advantage is this great, the bear can become prey (see Bengal tigers and Indian sloth bears). The same could be applied vice versa though; no Sri Lankan sloth bear wants to challenge a big Sri Lankan male leopard nor would a Syrian brown bear challenge a huge Persian male leopard. Except when the boars are large at the point where there's too much of a size advantage. A boar sun bear loses 9/10 to a male leopard from Central Africa and/or Iran. Those leopards are too big and powerful. The size difference would be too great. I doubt that boars average that much since Persian leopards aren't dwarfed by Syrian brown bears in camera traps. 250kg seems like a reasonable maximum weight for a Syrian boar brown bear IMO.
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Post by brobear on Aug 19, 2022 23:40:16 GMT -5
brobear No reports but the same applies vice versa in terms of the Syrian brown bear. There's no reason for a leopard to challenge a bear unless the size advantage is this great, the bear can become prey (see Bengal tigers and Indian sloth bears). The same could be applied vice versa though; no Sri Lankan sloth bear wants to challenge a big Sri Lankan male leopard nor would a Syrian brown bear challenge a huge Persian male leopard. Except when the boars are large at the point where there's too much of a size advantage. A boar sun bear loses 9/10 to a male leopard from Central Africa and/or Iran. Those leopards are too big and powerful. The size difference would be too great. I doubt that boars average that much since Persian leopards aren't dwarfed by Syrian brown bears in camera traps. 250kg seems like a reasonable maximum weight for a Syrian boar brown bear IMO. I'm sure that when hunting, a leopard would choose a bear well below his own weight to ambush. No different than a tiger. Also, should the Syrian brown bear choose to displace a leopard from his kill, the bear would not likely attempt this with a leopard his own size or bigger. Neither beast desires a risky fight. I agree that 250kg (550 pounds) is a possible maximum size for the Syrian brown bear.
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Post by brobear on Oct 16, 2022 15:16:30 GMT -5
1- I have never read a report of a leopard ever killing an adult bear of any species. 2- There are no records of either a puma or a jaguar killing an adult Andean bear (of either sex). 3- We have one report of an adult female cougar killing an adult female black bear from ambush. 4- We have one report of a jaguar killing an adult black bear from ambush. *Fact: cats do poorly against bears.
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Post by brobear on Oct 18, 2022 4:23:21 GMT -5
Translation text: In Aksu Dzhebagly (Talas Alatau) in the forest belt was found 2-year-old bear, and partially eaten zagryzenny IRBIS (Fig. 144). Judging by the signs of a struggle, the bear was caught by a leopard on placer stones, where digging roots. To escape, the bear climbed up the cliff, where he was captured. Leopard ate the back of the body and internal organs and other parts of the skin and did not touch (FD Shaposhnikov, 1956). Here, this predator in the morning kept watch deer that came to solonets. Published English text In the forest belt of Aksu-Dzhebagly preserve (Talassk Alatau) a two-year-old bear killed and partly eaten by an ounce was found (Fig. 144). Judging from traces of the fight, the bear was taken unawares while digging for roots in a rock stream. It tried to save itself by climbing onto a rock. The leopard had eaten the rear portion of the body and the viscera but had not touched the remainder, or the skin (F.D. Shaposhnikov, 1956). Here this predator had been iying in wait in the early morning for roe deer approaching on a solonetz. About the incident on the Caucasus Nature Reserve, there was no other information provided. Leopards in this area are very rare and the victims are described as two small bears suggesting perhaps older cubs or sub adult (sibling) victims. Caucasus form of brown bear vary in size but again we are talking about brown bear and leopard. As we understand the relationship between adult brown bears and big cats; logic here suggests we are talking about very young victims. shaggygod.proboards.com/thread/793/leopards-small-brown-bear
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Post by brobear on Oct 18, 2022 4:27:59 GMT -5
Large carnivores as potential predators of sun bears shaggygod.proboards.com/thread/1216/large-carnivores-potential-predators-bears Abstract: Sun bears (Helarctos malayanus) have a wide distribution in Southeast Asia, but little is known about their natural predators. During a camera-trap survey in 2018 in Htamanthi Wildlife Sanctuary, Myanmar, we photographed a male leopard (Panthera pardus) carrying a sun bear cub by the throat. This is the first reported case of probable predation on sun bears by leopards, and only their second confirmed predator. A literature review showed that consumption of sun bears and Asiatic black bears (Ursus thibetanus) by tigers (P. tigris) was widespread in Southeast Asia, whereas consumption of both bear species by leopards and dholes (Cuon alpinus) was less common. Outside of Southeast Asia, tigers and leopards, but not dholes, were shown to kill or consume other bear species. Future research should examine interspecific relationships between sun bears and large felids to better understand what, if any, impacts large felids have on sun bear ecology. Adult male leopard (Panthera pardus) carrying a sun bear (Helarctos malayanus) cub by the throat in Htamanthi Wildlife Sanctuary, northwestern Myanmar, 2018. Note the pair of canine puncture holes on the cub’s throat, which likely represents the kill bite.
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Post by brobear on Oct 21, 2022 11:10:48 GMT -5
Jaguar - Panthera onca The jaguar (Panthera onca) is a big cat, a feline in the Panthera genus, and is the only Panthera species found in the Americas. The jaguar is the third-largest feline after the tiger and the lion, and the largest in the Western Hemisphere. The jaguar's present range extends from Southern United States and Mexico across much of Central America and south to Paraguay and northern Argentina. While the jaguar closely resembles the leopard, it is generally sturdier and heavier, and the two animals can be distinguished by their rosettes: the rosettes on a jaguar's coat are larger, fewer in number, usually darker, and have thicker lines and small spots in the middle that the leopard lacks. Jaguars also have rounder heads and shorter, stockier limbs compared to leopards. Legs are also short, but thick and powerful, considerably shorter when compared to a small tiger or lion in a similar weight range. The jaguar stands 63 to 76 cm (25 to 30 in) tall at the shoulders. Weights of jaguars are normally in the range of 56–96 kg (123–212 lb). Its size and weight vary considerably: weights are normally in the range of 56–96 kg (123–212 lb). Exceptionally big males have been recorded to weigh as much as 158 kg (348 lb). _______________________________________________________________ New Mexico Black Bear - Ursus americanus amblyceps The New Mexico black bear (Ursus americanus amblyceps) is a subspecies of the American Black Bear ranging from Colorado, New Mexico, western Texas and the eastern half of Arizona into northern Mexico and southeastern Utah. It is a medium sized black bear, with adult males weighing between around 90 and 180 kg and adult females between around 45 and 114 kg. The length of adult bears averages around 170 cm for males and 150 cms for females. New Mexico black bears are omnivorous. In spring they eat grasses, flowering plants, roots, insects and carrion. In summer the diet expands to include berries, fruit and honey; and in autumn acorns, pinon nuts, and juniper berries. They will also eat small rodents and occasionally prey upon livestock. *348-pound jaguar vs 397-pound black bear face-to-face. Bear wins. The big cats are no joke. A cat is quick, amazingly agile, and armed with razor-sharp claws and strong jaws armed with long canine teeth. But the bear is simply built stronger, with greater girth which provides weight, strength, and durability. The bear has greater range of motion in his arms, greater stamina, and has practiced wrestling from early cub-hood. As a basic rule, a cat needs a weight advantage to win this fight.
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Post by brobear on Nov 17, 2022 17:34:20 GMT -5
Jaguar Fact Sheet www.jaguarssp.net/jagFactSheet.htm The jaguar is the largest cat in the Americas, with a record weight of over 347 pounds (158kg). The largest jaguars have been found in the Brazilian Pantanal region, where in one study the average weight of males was 220 pounds (100kg). Head and body length, without the tail may be up to six feet (1.85m), and the tail can measure 30 inches (75cm) more. Height at the shoulder may be up to 30 inches (75cm). The jaguar’s coat color ranges from pale yellow to reddish brown, with a much paler (often white) underbelly. It has spots on the neck, body and limbs that form rosettes, which contain black markings within them. On the head and underparts, the spots are simple black dots. Black jaguars are not uncommon, and even they possess darker rosette markings that are visible in bright light. Compared to a leopard, the jaguar is stocky and more powerfully built. The square jaw and prominent cheeks, along with robust, muscular limbs give evidence of immense strength. It has been said that the jaguar is built for power, not speed. While true, this cat also demonstrates surprising stealth and grace in movement.
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Post by brobear on Nov 17, 2022 17:47:20 GMT -5
Against any of the medium-sized bears, American black bear, moon bear, sloth bear, Andean bear, or giant panda, in a face-to-face fight, I would bet against a cougar, leopard, or even a Pantanal jaguar. Despite all of the hype of the biggest jaguars, like all other cats, they are ambush predators. Despite the hype, the jaguar is not the largest and strongest land-based predator of South America. The Andean bear, also called the Spectacled bear (Tremarctos ornatus), the last of the short-faced bears, stands at the top of this food chain.
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Post by brobear on Jun 12, 2023 12:34:37 GMT -5
The sloth bear comes closer in size to the leopard than to the tiger.
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Post by Ransik on Jun 13, 2023 1:57:22 GMT -5
Pantanal Jaguar is a better match for the sloth bear rather than the leopard since some individuals from the largest populations are known to surpess 300 pounds. Leopards are smaller and weaker than jaguars these cats rarely surpess 80kg in weight they're no match for sloth bears. Jaguars built more powerfully while leopards are built for stealth and agility so the jaguar might be able to get more beatings from the bear. But cats on general hate face to face confrontations with bears so the jaguar most likely will avoid the ferocious sloth bear just like tigers.
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Post by brobear on Jun 13, 2023 2:13:10 GMT -5
Pantanal Jaguar is a better match for the sloth bear rather than the leopard since some individuals from the largest populations are known to surpess 300 pounds. Leopards are smaller and weaker than jaguars these cats rarely surpess 80kg in weight they're no match for sloth bears. Jaguars built more powerfully while leopards are built for stealth and agility so the jaguar might be able to get more beatings from the bear. But cats on general hate face to face confrontations with bears so the jaguar most likely will avoid the ferocious sloth bear just like tigers. Jaguars do not prey upon Andean bears, which are basically within the same size range as sloth bears. So yes; I agree.
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Post by Ransik on Jun 14, 2023 0:57:23 GMT -5
Sloth bear and leopard both avoid one another
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Post by brobear on Jun 14, 2023 3:15:57 GMT -5
Quote; "Sloth bear and leopard both avoid one another" The sloth bear didn't change his course once he spotted the leopard. In fact, walked right up to it and appeared to take a sniff of the big cat. So, I would call that avoidance. Surprisingly, the leopard stayed put. Was the big cat holding onto a carcass, was this a she-cat with cubs, or possibly an injured leopard? Another interesting sloth bear/leopard confrontation can be found on Reply #76.
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Post by Ransik on Jun 24, 2023 9:02:15 GMT -5
Leopard and sloth bear meet
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Post by brobear on Nov 20, 2023 15:27:30 GMT -5
Posted by Pantherine on carnivora.net/viewtopic.php?p=105871#p105871 www.earthtouchnews.com/natural-world/predator-vs-prey/americas-celebrity-jaguar-el-jefe-is-a-bear-hunter/ While shadowing El Jefe in the Santa Rita backcountry, biologist Chris Bugbee discovered the strewn bones of a black bear, including a crushed, tooth-punctured skull (photographer Bill Hatcher was able to capture several snapshots of the remains). Assisting with the El Jefe-tracking task was Bugbee's dog Mayke, a Belgian Malinois specially trained to sniff out jaguar and ocelot poop. Back at the lab, analysis later confirmed that jaguar scat collected at the scene contained bear hairs. According to Bugbee's colleague (and wife) Aletris Neils, with whom he runs the nonprofit Conservation CATalyst, the bear skeleton likely belonged to a young adult sow. The unusual find, Bugbee suggests, marks the first known instance of a jaguar preying on a black bear. Such an event could only occur in the American Southwest or northern Mexico, where the stomping grounds of the mainly temperate black bear and the mainly tropical/subtropical jaguar overlap. "It was north against south, and south won," Neils tells Smithsonian. Young adult female American black bear ambushed and killed by a jaguar. This makes a total of #! black bear killed by a jaguar - young female by ambush. ...And also a total of #1 black bear killed by a cougar - young female by ambush.
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