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Post by King Kodiak on Dec 23, 2018 10:04:40 GMT -5
4 bulls beaten, wow, that is just incredible. We have to understand that beating just 1 or 2 is alredy incredible, now imagine 4.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 3, 2019 8:46:39 GMT -5
And while the bears were almost always beating bulls in the Roman arena and in the California pit fights, this is what happens when a bull and a lion meet.
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Post by brobear on Jan 3, 2019 9:21:32 GMT -5
The lion hopes to escape. There is a similar video from the 1933 movie, "King of the Jungle" starring Buster Crabbe as Kaspa, the lion man. A "jungle man" similar to Tarzan who was raised by lions. In this movie is an old film clip from an actual fight between a lion and a huge domestic bull. Similar results.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 3, 2019 10:08:25 GMT -5
Nice Brobear. Just shows the difference between bears and lions when it comes to facing bulls in a closed arena or pit.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2019 9:37:28 GMT -5
I just found very rare footage of a bear fighting a bull in the wild in the Russian republic of Altai. Looks like the bull is all hurt.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2019 10:17:33 GMT -5
As is the most common method of killing among brown bears, a bite to the spine. Seems like in every such video, the people are being a pain-in-the-butt.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2019 10:22:10 GMT -5
As is the most common method of killing among brown bears, a bite to the spine. Seems like in every such video, the people are being a pain-in-the-butt. Yeah grappling and biting of the spine.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 9, 2019 17:19:22 GMT -5
Anyways...judging by the accounts of bears beating spanish bulls most times in Rome and then in California, and knowing grizzlies hunted bison in prairie and Sierra Nevada many times, and then seeing the accounts of tigers getting whiped, its 100% clear that bears do much better than tigers in face to face fights against bovines. When it comes tu hunting bovines, the tiger does much better of course.
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Post by Kamchatka on Jan 9, 2019 18:21:06 GMT -5
No.
Many 'variables' apply to contests done for human spectators.
Staged fights may have pre-arranged outcome due to corrupt organisation/betting.
Captured animals used may be lacking in skills or be in neglected/weakened condition.
Here is video showing expert wild tiger 'bulldogging' KO buffalo then bluffing others.
Only similarly expert bear with cattle-beast 'wrangling' experience could emulate.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 9, 2019 18:39:52 GMT -5
Wrong. Staged fights are the best way to see real face to face fights. Locked in a cage or pit, face to face, nowhere to run, nowhere to hide, until death. Some animals are even healthier than in the wild. In the wild, there is even more of a chance that the animals attacked are sick or weak, that is what all predators do, attack the weakest prey possible. Not to mention that when it comes to tigers its basically by ambush most times.
I have seen that video before, it must be the only one or one of the very few of a tiger attacking head on in the wild. you wont find much more.
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Post by Kamchatka on Jan 9, 2019 18:50:27 GMT -5
No.
Many staged fights are 'fixed' by direct human intent.
Check the study posted on this site which examines prey attack profiles of Panthera.
'Head on' attacks are noted as a typical tactic.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 9, 2019 19:05:55 GMT -5
You got zero proof of anything, just your opinion like always. And wrong again, tigers are oficially classified as “ambush predators” guess why? Think a little, why would they be called “ambush predators” ? because most times they attack face to face? Lmao.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 9, 2019 19:09:51 GMT -5
The tiger all silent, from the back, trying to hunt the bear, but what happened when the ambush failed and the bear noticed and turned around? Tiger ran away faster than a cheetah.
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Post by Kamchatka on Jan 9, 2019 19:15:45 GMT -5
No.
You do not understand.
Cats must usually be stealthy so get close to make sharp successful attack.
They 'wish' prey would just stand there for walk up head on take!
This is how organised tiger hunts were done in India. By tethered bait animal.
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Post by Kamchatka on Jan 9, 2019 19:25:24 GMT -5
Video shows a non-lethal interaction.
Who knows what was true motivation of tiger?
Not killing certainly.
This one shows tiger on sloth bear kill-mission.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 9, 2019 19:30:26 GMT -5
It does not matter if the prey does not stand still, tigers have perfected the art of ambush for hundreds of years, the prey is dead before he even realizes it. There is nothing more unfair than that. Tigers are looking for food, not a fight.
by the way, this is way off topic now.
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Post by Kamchatka on Jan 9, 2019 23:41:23 GMT -5
Hahahah.
Neither tiger nor bear knows fair from unfair by your overvaluation.
See Timothy Treadwell for example of such expectation.
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Post by brobear on Jan 10, 2019 0:13:55 GMT -5
Hahahah. Neither tiger nor bear knows fair from unfair by your overvaluation. See Timothy Treadwell for example of such expectation. This is true. Most fights between species in one way or another has to do with procuring food. Both the bear and the tiger will do this with as little risk as possible. The big cats are ambush predators. To go around challenging big powerful animals to a "fair fight" would not be wise. Now, back to Bulls and Bears.
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Post by tom on Jan 18, 2019 18:10:53 GMT -5
Hypothetical: 1400 pound Kodiak Brown Bear vs 2700 lb Belgian Blue bull. So... this is not your typical Bovine but a very large and muscular Bovine none the less. It's a Belgian Blue bull, yes it appears the Belgians like their animals large hence the Belgian draft horses. I know what your thinking but don't be fooled into thinking this a bull injected with steroids because it's not. It is a genetic mutation so to speak. First a little history on the Belgian Blues" The Belgian Blue has a natural mutation in the myostatin gene which codes for the protein, myostatin ("myo" meaning muscle and "statin" meaning stop).[5] Myostatin is a protein that inhibits muscle development. This mutation also interferes with fat deposition, resulting in very lean meat.[5] The truncated myostatin gene is unable to function in its normal capacity, resulting in accelerated lean muscle growth. Muscle growth is due primarily to physiological changes in the animal's muscle cells (fibers) from hypertrophy to a hyperplasia mode of growth. This particular type of growth is seen early in the fetus of a pregnant dam, which results in a calf that is born with two times the number of muscle fibers at birth than a calf with no myostatin gene mutation.[5] In addition, a newborn double-muscled calf's birth weight is significantly greater than that of a normal calf.[4]
Belgian Blue cattle have improved feed conversion ratio (FCR) due to lower feed intake compared to weight gain[4] due to an altered composition of body weight gain which includes increased protein and decreased fat deposition.[4] The Belgian Blue's bone structure is the same as normal cattle, albeit holding a greater amount of muscle, which causes them to have a greater meat to bone ratio. These cattle have a muscle yield around 20% more on average than cattle without the genetic myostatin mutation.[5] Because of this breed's increased muscle yield, a diet containing higher protein is required to compensate for the altered mode of weight gain.[4] During finishing, this breed requires high-energy (concentrated) feeds, and will not yield the same results if put on a high-fiber diet.[4]
The value of the double-muscling breed is due to their superior carcass characteristics. However, with decreased fat content is decreased marbling of meat, which means the meat tenderness is reduced. Conversely, the Belgian Blue's meat tenderness has been argued to be just as tender because a large number of smaller muscle fibers are present. So if this bull was raised in Kodiak country where the two would possibly meet would the Bear be able to prey upon and handle such a large bovine. I have to believe that with all that muscle comes incredible strength. The one big disadvantage is the absence of any head gear on the bull so that would be a big advantage for the Bear who could rake his claws on the behemoth bovine till it bled to death. But getting the bull off it's feet could prove a daunting task even for a large Bear.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 18, 2019 18:24:10 GMT -5
Wow that is a huge and very well built bull Tom. The answer is no. Not even a 1500 lb kodiak would even try to attack a 2700 lb bull like that. We have to remember that grizzlies very rarely have attacked adult male bisons which get up to 2200 lbs max.
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