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Post by brobear on Mar 11, 2022 9:32:22 GMT -5
I second that. Bulls are extremely powerful. And they have big horns that can stick into things. LOL   |
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Post by brobear on Mar 11, 2022 9:58:17 GMT -5
About the 2700 lb Belgium blue bull. Size matters, but so do weapons and fighting ability. IMO - a big boar grizzly could kill this monster more easily that a Spanish Fighting bull.  Belgium blue bull is 2700 pounds of muscle, but designed for providing lots of lean meat; not combat muscle. In a fight with a typical Yellowstone grizzly, this massive mountain of muscles might be able to defend himself for from 10 to 15 minutes ( IMO ) before he becomes totally exhausted and helpless to the grizzly's attack. |
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Post by brobear on Aug 26, 2022 2:39:52 GMT -5
El Toron - Spain's Most Legendary Fighting Bull | The Spirit Of The Bull | Real Wild
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Post by brobear on Aug 28, 2022 9:33:10 GMT -5
Bigger not always better.  |
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Post by brobear on Sept 4, 2022 8:56:07 GMT -5
Huge-Horn Steer
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Post by Montezuma on Sept 7, 2022 7:53:50 GMT -5
Bigger not always better. i agree. He does not look vicious fighter either like most bulls. |
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Post by brobear on Oct 14, 2022 4:45:48 GMT -5
Aurochs - Bos primigenius The aurochs, also known as urus or ure (Bos primigenius), is an extinct species of large wild cattle that inhabited Europe, Asia, and North Africa. It is the ancestor of domestic cattle; it has also been suggested as an ancestor genetically to the modern European bison, which have been crossbred with steppe bison. The species survived in Europe until 1627, when the last recorded aurochs died in the Jaktorów Forest, Poland. he aurochs were one of the largest herbivores in postglacial Europe, comparable to the wisent (European bison). The size of an aurochs appears to have varied by region; in Europe, northern populations were bigger on average than those from the south. For example, during the Holocene, aurochs from Denmark and Germany had an average height at the shoulders of 155–180 cm (61–71 in) in bulls and 135–155 cm (53–61 in) in cows, while aurochs populations in Hungary had bulls reaching 155–160 cm (61–63 in). The body mass of aurochs appears to have shown some variability. Some individuals were comparable in weight to the wisent and the banteng, reaching around 700 kg (1,540 lb), whereas those from the late-middle Pleistocene are estimated to have weighed up to 1,500 kg (3,310 lb), as much as the largest gaur (the largest extant bovid). The sexual dimorphism between bulls and cows was strongly expressed, with the cows being significantly shorter than bulls on average. __________________________________________________________________________ Quote: "Those from the late-middle Pleistocene are estimated to have weighed up to 1,500 kg (3,310 lb), as much as the largest gaur." *It is probable that the Steppe brown bear and possibly the cave bear (Ursus ingressus) sometimes hunted aurochs. This would naturally, in isolated cases, place the bear against a bull auroch. *The auroch appears to be quite similar in physical form to the modern Spanish fighting bulls.  |
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 14, 2022 5:54:22 GMT -5
/\ Out of all polar bears, only an exceptionally large male polar bear has a chance to kill that monster.
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Post by brobear on Oct 14, 2022 9:33:34 GMT -5
/\ Out of all polar bears, only an exceptionally large male polar bear has a chance to kill that monster. A big boar polar bear would probably not do well against a really huge bovine (imo) due to the fact that his regular prey choice is seals. |
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 16, 2022 1:57:07 GMT -5
/\ Out of all polar bears, only an exceptionally large male polar bear has a chance to kill that monster. A big boar polar bear would probably not do well against a really huge bovine (imo) due to the fact that his regular prey choice is seals. He could learn as there are accounts of polar bears killing musk oxens, sadly no modern days accounts. |
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Post by brobear on Oct 16, 2022 2:49:51 GMT -5
A big boar polar bear would probably not do well against a really huge bovine (imo) due to the fact that his regular prey choice is seals. He could learn as there are accounts of polar bears killing musk oxens, sadly no modern days accounts. The California grizzlies did well against bulls in the arena fights conducted in Old California and (I suppose) Old Mexico. Those brown bears were already experienced in killing bovine from hunting the feral cattle known as 'range cattle.' Brown bears in Europe, in the distant past, also had a variety of wild bovine to hunt and kill. They usually defeated the bull in the Roman arena. But, I believe that, when a bear faces a really huge, powerful, and aggressive bull (Spanish fighting bull, bison, buffalo, etc.) that bear had better know what he is doing. Experience needed. |
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 16, 2022 10:47:26 GMT -5
/\ Meaning a male polar bear that kills musk oxens stands the best chance against bovines. In my opinion, it is harder to kill walruses than bovines. Walruses have extremely thick skin coupled by blubber around their neck. Belugas are hard to kill too as their skin is 100 times thicker than that of land mammals (in general) coupled by blubber too. They virtually have no neck too.
Btw I am talking about defense only.
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Post by brobear on Oct 16, 2022 14:50:26 GMT -5
/\ Meaning a male polar bear that kills musk oxens stands the best chance against bovines. In my opinion, it is harder to kill walruses than bovines. Walruses have extremely thick skin coupled by blubber around their neck. Belugas are hard to kill too as their skin is 100 times thicker than that of land mammals (in general) coupled by blubber too. They virtually have no neck too. Btw I am talking about defense only. A walrus or a beluga are thick-skinned. This is true. But neither are very quick on their feet. A muskox or a bull fight much differently than something that moves like an over-sized caterpillar on dry land. But yes; a polar bear experienced with musk ox might stand a better chance than no experience at all. |
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 16, 2022 15:30:49 GMT -5
/\ We agree  . Male polar bear is also heavier and stronger than musk oxen on average. According to Great Bear of Almanac, it is the old line bulls that are targeted. Off topic: Polar bear attacking beluga in open water is impressive. |
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Oct 16, 2022 15:32:49 GMT -5
![]() ![]() The barren ground grizzly@the musk oxen hunter. |
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Post by brobear on Oct 18, 2022 6:55:22 GMT -5
Iberian (Spanish) Fighting Bull The Spanish Fighting Bull (Toro Bravo, toro de lidia, toro lidiado, ganado bravo, Touro de Lide) is an Iberian cattle breed. It is primarily bred free-range on extensive estates in Southern Spain, Portugal and Latin American countries where bull fighting is organized. Fighting bulls are selected primarily for a certain combination of aggression, energy, strength, stamina and lack of intelligence: a bull intelligent enough to distinguish man from cape would be too dangerous. The fighting bull is characterized by its aggressive behaviour, especially when solitary or unable to flee. Many are coloured black or dark brown, but other colorations are normal. They reach maturity slower than meat breeds as they were not selected to be heavy, having instead an well-muscled "athletic" look, with a prominent morillo, a complex of muscles over the shoulder and neck which gives the bull its distinctive profile and strength with its horns. The horns are longer than in most other breeds and are also present in both males and females . Mature bulls weigh from 500 to 700 kg (1100-1600 lb).  |
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Post by brobear on Oct 18, 2022 7:06:47 GMT -5
The Boone and Crockett record inland grizzly skull scored a 27 and 13/16 while the record Ussuri brown bear skull scored 27.6 inches. The grizzly skull ( picked up ) in Lone Mountain, Alaska was from the Old West days of the great buffalo herds. That skull is considered to be a typical-sized adult male grizzly of the Great Plains. They were at least as big as Russia's Ussuri brown bears or perhaps some larger. W.P. Hubbard was probably 'right-on-the-money' when he stated that the grizzly of the prairie averaged roughly 850 pounds. In every book I have read concerning the historic grizzly ( those that touched on the subject ) stated that the grizzlies of the open prairie were bigger that those of the Rocky Mountains and rivaled only by those of the West Coast. It stands to reason, that a population of grizzlies with a very high percentage of red meat consumption would be very large bears. At the very least, as big as Ussuri brown bears. I would wager on an 800+ pound brown bear (experienced in killing cattle) against the Iberian (Spanish) Fighting Bull. Although - not a sure bet.  |
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. Male polar bear is also heavier and stronger than musk oxen on average. According to Great Bear of Almanac, it is the old line bulls that are targeted.