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Post by King Kodiak on Dec 24, 2020 7:21:44 GMT -5
theundertaker45: The contemporary and historical is the same as we had on page 1.
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Post by brobear on Dec 24, 2020 7:23:31 GMT -5
theundertaker45 : The contemporary and historical is the same as we had on page 1. *Proves we are correct.
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Post by theundertaker45 on Dec 24, 2020 7:27:28 GMT -5
King KodiakYes, the numbers for historical and modern specimens remained the same but the number for all weights collected was adjusted by a slight bit.
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Post by OldGreenGrolar on Dec 27, 2020 3:12:19 GMT -5
^ Per Christiansen 1999 Credited to Nocapakabl.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 11:32:49 GMT -5
From page #1: Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 9 years+ ) - 631.4 pounds. But when you average up their weights 10 years old and up you get - 298 kg or 657 pounds. Also note, with any wild animal, the averages we find are always taken from a small handful of specimens. Go out 5 years later and do another study, and you come home with new numbers. Personally, I believe that averages should always be rounded off, as no estimated average is precise and ready to be set in stone. Average adult male Ussuri brown bear roughly 650 pounds. ( IMO ).
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 13:29:47 GMT -5
Well yeah, we can round out numbers, but that would be just speculating even more. The most precise way to get the most reliable average weight is the weighted specimens. From the latest source, we have 5 specimens of 9+ year olds that weighted 631 lbs, so that is the most precise number that we have. Yes, 5 specimens is a very small sample, but that is all we can go by.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 13:44:15 GMT -5
Well yeah, we can round out numbers, but that would be just speculating even more. The most precise way to get the most reliable average weight is the weighted specimens. From the latest source, we have 5 specimens of 9+ year olds that weighted 631 lbs, so that is the most precise number that we have. Yes, 5 specimens is a very small sample, but that is all we can go by. Wrong. Rounding off numbers is NOT speculation. We collect the actual results from the various studies. But in knowing that each study comes from a small number of individual animals, we can reasonably round the numbers off. Its kinda stupid to say the average male Ussuri brown bear weighs 631 pounds - one pound? Here are our results: Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 9 years+ ) - 631.4 pounds. Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 10 years+) - 657 pounds. Average fully-grown female Ussuri brown bear (7 years+) - 361 pounds. So, in saying that the average full-grown male Ussuri brown bear weighs roughly 650 pounds is not wrong. ...and not mere speculation.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 13:56:55 GMT -5
Yes, 631 lbs, why? Because like i said before, we have to go by what we have, and what we have are 5 specimens of 9+ year olds that weighed 631 lbs, so we have to go by that.
650 lbs is just a simple speculation, in that case it can be 600 lbs, 700 lbs, whatever. 631 lbs is the best we got.
Trust me, everyone thinks the Ussuri brown bear averages 595 lbs or less, so its hard enough to convince them that it weights 631 lbs, let alone 650 lbs. You are just bringing up that number to your convenience.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 14:03:21 GMT -5
You're not paying attention Kodiak. You added-up and averaged the 5 Ussuri brown bears weighed. First of all, why would you believe that those five will give you an absolute average? I removed the one 9-year-old and averaged the four 10+ year olds. 305 lbs + 268 lbs + 363 lbs + 256 lbs = 1,192 divided by 4 = 298 kg = 657 pounds. Here are our results: Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 9 years+ ) - 631.4 pounds. Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 10 years+) - 657 pounds. Average fully-grown female Ussuri brown bear (7 years+) - 361 pounds.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 14:10:51 GMT -5
Thats good, you made the calculations of the 10+ year olds, that is good for info. But i believe the 9+ year olds is good enough already. We know we can take 9 as the youngest for fully grown brown bears.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 14:15:02 GMT -5
Because its all we have dont we? Unfortunately, we dont have 10, 15, 30, 50, or 100, 9+ year old bears weighted. The source only gave us those 5 specimens. You get my point? What else can we base an average off if not for those 5 specimens?
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 14:34:36 GMT -5
Because its all we have dont we? Unfortunately, we dont have 10, 15, 30, 50, or 100, 9+ year old bears weighted. The source only gave us those 5 specimens. You get my point? What else can we base an average off if not for those 5 specimens?
I agree. My point exactly. No number is carved in stone. We record and collect what we have. Then realistically, we can give an average that makes some sense. You seem to be stuck on 631 pounds. Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 9 years+ ) - 631.4 pounds. Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 10 years+) - 657 pounds Average full-grown male Ussuri brown bear - 650 pounds. Average fully grown male Yellowstone grizzly (9 years+) - 518 pounds = 520 pounds. Average fully grown male Alaska Peninsula brown bear (9 years+) - 857.6 pounds = 855 pounds. Average mature Amur tiger (contemporary) - 418.9 pounds = 420 pounds. Average mature Bengal tiger - 463 pounds = 465 pounds. Average lion - 371.3 pounds = 370 pounds.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 14:45:05 GMT -5
I am stuck at 631 lbs because that is what those 5 specimens averaged. Dont get me wrong, 650 lbs sounds realiable also, but its just an estimation, but you can use that if you want.
And why are you saying the Yellowstone grizzky is 520 lbs? The only chart we have, for the 9+ year olds, the average is 470 lbs, and that was for 32 specimens.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 14:52:12 GMT -5
Simply a place to save weight data results for easy access: In any such study, the measurements and weights are taken by a small handful of specimens. Even 20 specimens is just a handful. To get an absolutely accurate average weight, every single ( example ) 9+ year old Ussuri brown bear would have to be drugged and weighed, counted and averaged - an absolutely impossible task. Therefore, we know that any number we get is not a number to be carved in stone. Clearly, we can rightfully narrow each number down to the nearest 10 pounds with no wrong doing. Be alert for new studies and possible number changes.
Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 9 years+ ) - 631.4 pounds. Average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 10 years+) - 657 pounds. Average fully-grown female Ussuri brown bear (7 years+) - 361 pounds. Average mature male Yellowstone grizzly (5 years+) - 425.5 pounds. Average mature female Yellowstone grizzly (5 years+) - 295.4 pounds. Average fully grown male Yellowstone grizzly (9 years+) - 518 pounds. Average fully grown female Yellowstone grizzly (7 years+) - 304.08 pounds. Average mature male Alaska Peninsula brown bear (5 years+) - 787.1 pounds. Average mature female Alaska Peninsula brown bear (5 years+) - 498.2 pounds. Average fully grown male Alaska Peninsula brown bear (9 years+) - 857.6 pounds Average mature male polar bear (6 years+) - 1075 pounds. Average mature female polar bear (5 years+) - 485 pounds. Average mature male Foxe Basin polar bear (5 years+) - 1300 pounds. Average mature male Kodiak bear (5 years+) - 769 pounds. Average mature female Kodiak bear (5 years+) - 407.7 pounds. Average fully grown male Kodiak bear (9 years+) - 1077.3 pounds. Average fully grown female Kodiak bear (7 years+) - 446.5 pounds.
Average mature male Romanian brown bear (5 years+) - 590 pounds.
Average fully grown male Yellowstone grizzly ( 9 years+ ) - 518 pounds = 520 pounds.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 14:53:09 GMT -5
Were you the one who changed this at page 1? NO.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 15:02:01 GMT -5
Reply #72 - Fully grown/Prime male grizzlies (all boars being at least 9y of age and not too old; I excluded one male at 27y of age): ~217.4kg (~479.3lbs; n=8). Brown Bears - Size - Reply #324: Average weight for the age class 9y+ (fully grown): 213kg (470lbs; n=32)
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 15:07:43 GMT -5
Reply #72 - Fully grown/Prime male grizzlies (all boars being at least 9y of age and not too old; I excluded one male at 27y of age): ~217.4kg (~479.3lbs; n=8). Yes, but that is from the Cabinet-Yaak area situated in northwestern Montana and northeastern Idaho. Not Yellowstone.
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 15:12:59 GMT -5
Reply #72 - Fully grown/Prime male grizzlies (all boars being at least 9y of age and not too old; I excluded one male at 27y of age): ~217.4kg (~479.3lbs; n=8). Yes, but that is from the Cabinet-Yaak area situated in northwestern Montana and northeastern Idaho. Not Yellowstone.OK; and Montana grizzlies are some larger than Wyoming grizzlies. Yellowstone; beautiful but not a lush environment for grizzlies. Edit and add: IF I did write down: 518 pounds; I do not remember doing it nor remember any such source. But then, my memory has seen better days.
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Post by King Kodiak on Jan 6, 2021 15:33:53 GMT -5
Brobear, i think its pretty stupid to argue about this to be honest. No one is wrong here.
Me: all i am doing is going by the exact data that we have. 5 Ussuri specimens, 9+, 631 lbs. This is actual data, not wrong.
You: you are just rounding up that number to 650 lbs. That is not wrong either.
But no one is wrong, we agree now brobear?
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Post by brobear on Jan 6, 2021 15:36:22 GMT -5
Me: all i am doing is going by the exact data that we have. 5 Ussuri specimens, 9+, 631 lbs. This is actual data, not wrong. As is average fully-grown male Ussuri brown bear ( 10 years+) - 657 pounds. This too is actual data, not wrong. *Edit and add: I did not round off 631 pounds to 650 pounds. I looked at both figures.
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