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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2022 18:09:10 GMT -5
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SKULLs
Aug 21, 2022 1:55:10 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Aug 21, 2022 1:55:10 GMT -5
Fossil Bear from South Africa journals.co.za/doi/pdf/10.10520/AJA00382353_4931 South African Journal of Science Vol. 73 April 1977 Table 4. Measurements of mandible in Agriotherium africanum from Langebaanweg The skull of A. africanum differs in detail from those of all living species of bears. but it is unmistakeably bearlike in its general appearance (Fig. I). The muzzle is particularly distinctive, being relatively short and broad, ·with the palate being shorter even than that of such "short-faced" bears as Arclodus. 10 In ArclOdus, and most other bears, the post-palatine incisure terminates well behind the second molars. but in Agriolherium africanum the second molars are in line with the incisure (Fig. 2). In addition, the upper molars of this species are themselves relatively short, which is characteristic of Agriolherium. The braincase is relatively narrow, but the sagittal crest is extremely high and the zygomatic arches are stout. indicating strong jaw musculature, which is in keeping with the large size of the jaws (Tables I and 4) and most of the teeth (Tables 2 and 5)
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SKULLs
Aug 21, 2022 6:06:13 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 6:06:13 GMT -5
Good paper brobear. I haven't read the whole paper but we have a measurement for the mandible about Agriotherium africanum: 296mm. The mandible i posted is 362.54 mm. We all like large bears, so i propose to investigate a bit more this specimen.
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SKULLs
Aug 21, 2022 7:44:10 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Aug 21, 2022 7:44:10 GMT -5
Good paper brobear. I haven't read the whole paper but we have a measurement for the mandible about Agriotherium africanum: 296mm. The mandible i posted is 362.54 mm. We all like large bears, so i propose to investigate a bit more this specimen. So, the Indarctos mandible is larger than that of the huge A. africanum. Awesome. You need to know, and unlike many posters I have debated with, I don't hide the fact, I have a G.E.D. education. While I have read 70+ books on bears over a course of time, I lack the education to comprehend much out of college-level studies.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 9:12:42 GMT -5
No problem brobear, i am just here to obtain and share data about bears which are my favourite terrestrial carnivores. I try to imagine as accurately as possible the apparence and life of prehistoric bears. Of course i like all others carnivores like big cats, canids, hyenas, creodonts and much more. The goal is to have a constructive debate. I hate fanboys, they are parasites that give no importance to the scientific facts, the logic and have no common sense. I like serious discussions with common sense or better: real data.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 19:37:03 GMT -5
Here you have the paper which contains data about gigantic skulls of cave bear . The largest skull that we know from complete remains is 57,14 cm in max length. geopaleo.fns.uniba.sk/images/zamestnanci/pdf/sabol/14sabol02a.pdfGood news, there are data about mandibles: the largest mandible length in the paper is 338,2 mm. Indarctos mandible is 362.54 mm. I have not yet read the paper in details, but these data are very interesting. Of course some skulls are huge, but i think cave bears have a skull proportionaly bigger than the skulls of Ursus arctos. So it is possible that the giant skull (57cm) belongs to a bear not larger than the largest kodiak bears. But this one can also belongs to a bear approaching 1000kg, i don't know. We need someone who knows well the morphological differences between Ursus spelaeus and Ursus arctos. Attachments:
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Post by brobear on Aug 21, 2022 21:38:31 GMT -5
From Reply #285 above:
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SKULLs
Oct 20, 2022 0:59:13 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Oct 20, 2022 0:59:13 GMT -5
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Post by brobear on Oct 24, 2022 2:50:00 GMT -5
Skulls:
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Post by theundertaker45 on Oct 24, 2022 3:35:37 GMT -5
I've just seen that there is a 571mm cave bear skull in hibernour's post. Even with their large heads in comparison to body size, this thing would definitely pass 1000kg, an absolute monster of a bear. In comparison, the largest Arctodus simus skull ever recovered is just a slight bit longer than the longest brown bear skull ever found in Port Heiden, Alaska.
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SKULLs
Oct 24, 2022 4:58:51 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Oct 24, 2022 4:58:51 GMT -5
Cave Bear: 57 centimeters is equal to 22.44 inches. WORLD'S RECORDS ALASKA BROWN BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 17 15/16 Greatest width of skull: 12 13/16 SCORE: 30 12/16 *I agree 'Taker. That cave bear (I assume Ursus Ingressus) should certainly weigh no less than 1,000-kg or 2200-pounds. Nice find hibernours. FYI, the site provided does not work for me.
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SKULLs
Oct 24, 2022 6:28:22 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Oct 24, 2022 6:28:22 GMT -5
So far, the skull with the greatest length in history belongs to the cave bear (Ursus Ingressus/Ursus Kanivetz) with 57.14 cm (571.4 mm)
Score: 32.55 inches.
Here is the same cave bear skull from Reply #98 posted Nov 1, 2020. I would sure like to see this bear "in the flesh" alive.
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Post by theundertaker45 on Oct 24, 2022 7:05:55 GMT -5
brobearThis bear would be of enormous dimensions; possibly reaching a shoulder height of 170cm, weighing over 1000kg and measuring a full 3 metres or more in a straight line.
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Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2022 0:19:51 GMT -5
Credits to Warsaw: On the left black bear skull 22 12/16 " At the center brown bear skull 29 " On the rigth black bear skull 22 9/16
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SKULLs
Nov 3, 2022 0:33:53 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Nov 3, 2022 0:33:53 GMT -5
brobear This bear would be of enormous dimensions; possibly reaching a shoulder height of 170cm, weighing over 1000kg and measuring a full 3 metres or more in a straight line. Possible size of Ursus ungressus: shoulder height of 170cm or 66.93 inches (rounded off at 5 feet 7 inches). HB length in a straight line at a full 3 metres or more or 9 feet 10 inches (or more). weighing over 1000kg or 2,204.62 pounds (or more).
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SKULLs
Nov 29, 2022 3:12:10 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Nov 29, 2022 3:12:10 GMT -5
Skulls bowhunting.net/2022/06/bear-anatomy-and-physiology/ Generally, the skulls of bears are massive, typically long, wide across the forehead with prominent eyebrow ridges, a large jawbone hinge, and with heavy jaw muscles and broad nostrils. Combined with dentition, the structure of bears’ skulls are very much carnivorous, though with omnivore modifications. The skull may be the most important feature of an animal, housing the brain, providing a major protective and nutritional feature (mouth with teeth), and containing sensory-communication features. “Bear skulls undergo a series of changes from early life to old age, and in most species do not attain their mature form until seven or more years of age,” observed C. H. Merriam in North American Fauna, Biological Survey, 1918. Diet and other eating habits have influenced the individual development of the heads and skulls of each species. “Head shape and size . . . are influenced by dentition and jaw muscles,” write Paul Shepard and Barry Sanders in The Sacred Paw.”. . . [skulls] are shaped to anchor the appropriate muscles. Because of the heavy jaw muscles it [spectacled bear] uses for crushing palm nuts, its skull shape is unusual, rather resembling that of the giant panda, which has massive molars for grinding bamboo shoots.” Brown bears normally do not bite to kill, but have grinding, crunching teeth with the massive muscles to accomplish the task. Polar bears are more carnivorous than other bears, and do bite to kill; their skulls are specifically shaped for the appropriate teeth and muscles to hold, chop, and slash their prey. Each of the eight bear species has its own distinctive skull shape and size. Animal classification is primarily based on skulls (“. . .details of skull and leg bones are the usual criteria for the biologists,” note Shepard and Sanders) and in part led to the “splitting” of the bear species. Skull size is also the criteria for the “record size” bears of North America.
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SKULLs
Nov 29, 2022 3:15:03 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Nov 29, 2022 3:15:03 GMT -5
1- American Black Bear – Broad, narrow muzzle; large jaw hinge; female head may be more slender and pointed.
2- Brown Bear – Massive; heavily constructed; large in proportion to body; high forehead (steeply rising); concave (dishedface); domed head; long muzzle; flat nose tip; ears barely observed as bumps; eyes tiny.
3- Polar Bear – Large; small in proportion to body; long; snout long (warms air); Roman nose; large eyes.
4- Asiatic Black Bear – Large; sloping forehead.
5- Giant Panda – Massive; wide muzzle; zygomatic arches widely spread; constructed for attachment of powerful jaw muscles; short muzzle.
6- Sloth Bear – Thick; long muzzle; small jaws; bulbous snout; wide nostrils.
7- Sunbear – Wide and flat (unbear like); short muzzle.
8- Spectacled Bear – Wide; short muzzle; lower jaw shorter than upper (overbite); unusual skull shape; resembles giant panda; young and female skulls narrow and long.
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SKULLs
Dec 3, 2022 6:17:23 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Dec 3, 2022 6:17:23 GMT -5
Record Amur (Ussuri) brown bear, Sakhalin island, October, 2005.
Skull measurement: GSL: 18 5/16 inch, GSW: 10 6/16 inch.
Score: 28 11/16 inches.
WORLD'S RECORDS BLACK BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 14 12/16 Greatest width of skull: 8 14/16 SCORE: 23 10/16 WORLD'S RECORDS GRIZZLY BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 17 4/16 Greatest width of skull: 10 9/16 SCORE: 27 13/16 WORLD'S RECORDS ALASKA BROWN BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 17 15/16 Greatest width of skull: 12 13/16 SCORE: 30 12/16 WORLD'S RECORDS POLAR BEAR: Greatest length of skull without lower jaw: 18 8/16 Greatest width of skull: 11 7/16 SCORE: 29 15/16
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Post by brobear on Dec 7, 2022 2:15:39 GMT -5
Compare sloth bear and moon bear skulls:
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SKULLs
Dec 7, 2022 2:32:06 GMT -5
Post by brobear on Dec 7, 2022 2:32:06 GMT -5
I was going to average them out. The average total for the sloth bear and the average total for the moon bear. However, my math in working fractions is a bit rusty, to say the least.
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