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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2018 3:57:24 GMT -5
Not leopards, cougars, nor even jaguars prey upon bears of any species other than small cubs. So wait cougars don't prey on black bears? I remember reading of an incident of a cougar killing a female black bear.
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2018 3:59:35 GMT -5
Not leopards, cougars, nor even jaguars prey upon bears of any species other than small cubs. So wait cougars don't prey on black bears? I remember reading of an incident of a cougar killing a female black bear. If this is true it was certainly an unusual incident. Post it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2018 4:32:06 GMT -5
So wait cougars don't prey on black bears? I remember reading of an incident of a cougar killing a female black bear. If this is true it was certainly an unusual incident. Post it. I actually can't find it right now because the old carnivora site is gone. Do you know how I can access the old carnivora site?
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2018 4:38:53 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2018 4:40:26 GMT -5
Where is the old black bear vs cougar thread at? I don't see it This ain't the same carnivora site that I remember.
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2018 4:50:25 GMT -5
Where is the old black bear vs cougar thread at? I don't see it This ain't the same carnivora site that I remember. Well, maybe we will come across it another day.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2018 4:54:31 GMT -5
Where is the old black bear vs cougar thread at? I don't see it This ain't the same carnivora site that I remember. Well, maybe we will come across it another day. Yeah this is definitely not the same one I remember from months ago. All the post on this carnivora forum are fairly new. No more than 6 months old.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 13, 2018 5:27:19 GMT -5
A cougar could have killed a female black bear by ambush, that yes.
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Post by brobear on Nov 13, 2018 5:35:29 GMT -5
shaggygod.proboards.com/ Bear Mortality by Cougars I think recent research show both black/grizzly bears to benefit from cougar production of animal matter. Honestly, I have a hard time believing old 19th century American West accounts of the larger grizzly and black bear fatality involving cougars (35-85 kg) who rarely exceed 200 lbs. After a strong search of the literature, the only piece of information I found was a percentage (%) occurrence of prey calculation by authors Kerry Murphy and Toni K. Ruth (see below reference) showing black bears in Montana/Wyoming to make up 1% of cougar diet. No additional victim profile information (e.g., cubs) is given. The authors do note that scat analysis of animal matter does not always mean predation explaining how cougars can also scavenge carrion. IMO, one of the best, comprehensive cougar publications came out a few years ago: Hornocker, M., and S. Negri (Eds.). 2009. Cougar: ecology and conservation. University of Chicago Press. Chicago, IL. The book has terrific data on cougar predatory/prey relations and cougar interference competition dynamics as it relates to bears covering both North & South America including black & grizzly bear relations and to some extent (if one interprets the absence of data as information) spectacle bear relations. On the latter, there were no spectacled bear signatures in South American cougar diet analysis.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 19, 2018 0:42:10 GMT -5
news.mongabay.com/2018/02/mountain-lions-often-lose-to-wolves-and-bears-study-finds/amp/Mountain lions often lose to wolves and bears, study finds Shreya Dasgupta Shreya Dasgupta 10 months ago Puma. Photo by Rhett A. Butler. The large, secretive puma (Puma concolor) may be at the top of its food chain, but it is not always the king of its territory. Native to the Americas, the puma, also called the mountain lion, cougar, catamount or panther, often shares its habitat with several other top predators, such as wolves, bears, coyotes and jaguars. But when the hunting grounds of these predators overlap, the puma is often the loser, researchers report in a new study published in PeerJ. By reviewing the scientific literature on competition between pumas and other predators, researchers have found that wolves, grizzly bears, black bears and jaguars often dominate pumas. In fact, pumas are subordinate to at least one other top carnivore in 47.5 percent of their range across North and South America. In turn, pumas seem to be dominant only over coyotes and maned wolves. “I recognized the hole in my own understanding of mountain lions — I knew so little about their relationships with other animals,” said lead author Mark Elbroch, lead scientist for puma program at the global wild cat conservation organization Panthera. “A review seemed the ideal way to search for and find research on the subject.” Pumas are often in competition with other top predators. And they don’t always win. Picture by Panthera. Among the top predators, wolves appear to have the strongest influence on mountain lions, dominating pumas on most encounters, Elbroch’s team found. This is likely because wolves hunt in packs and outnumber the generally solitary puma. Wolves often harass pumas, the authors write, and are also known to kill them. Some studies also show that wherever the ranges of pumas and wolves overlap, pumas tend to avoid open areas and restrict their movements to forests and steep areas where they can easily escape from wolves. Pumas also sometimes switch their prey when living alongside wolves. The interactions between grizzly and black bears and pumas is less studied, the researchers found. But the studies that exist show that bears often displace pumas from their kills. So pumas not only lose the food they hunted, but have to spend additional time and energy hunting more prey. Bears taking meals from pumas. Video by Mark Elbroch/Panthera. A young male mountain lion (follow the red arrow) in northwest Wyoming just pushed off his kill by the wolf in the foreground. Photo by Mark Elbroch/Panthera. The study’s findings are especially important given how pumas are still being intensively hunted over much of their range in a bid to reduce conflicts with people and livestock, Elbroch said. Hunting has wiped out mountain lions from the entire eastern half of North America, except for a small population in Florida. Today, pumas occur in parts of western North America, and Central and South America, where they continue to be hunted. In some of these areas, where wolves and bears are recolonizing and recovering, wildlife managers need to be cautious about hunting limits for pumas, the authors write. “New wolves mean life for mountain lions just got a little bit harder,” Elbroch said. “So increasing pressure on mountain lions is the exact opposite of what our review suggests is needed. “Ecosystems are complex, and we must be cautious,” he added. “When we hunt species already affected by numerous other species, we may unintentionally cause rapid declines in that species. To manage wildlife effectively, we must first understand how they fit into their ecosystems.” However, there is a dearth of studies looking at interactions between pumas and other apex carnivores, Elbroch said. And the available research does not go deep enough to link the effects of competition on puma survival. “It’s tough being a mountain lion, which only makes their resilience and ability to live among and in between us that much more remarkable,” Elbroch said. “They continue to amaze me.”
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 19, 2018 0:45:45 GMT -5
I think we also pretty much established here that grizzly and black bears of all sizes dominate pumas.
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Post by brobear on Nov 19, 2018 2:01:21 GMT -5
Consider that the cougar ( the cat with many names ) survived the Last Ice Age of the Pleistocene, along with the grey wolf, black bear, and grizzly when a rather large number of big cats went extinct. You gotta hand it to the little guy; he adapts to change and has proven to be an excellent survivor.
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Post by King Kodiak on Nov 19, 2018 5:25:48 GMT -5
Consider that the cougar ( the cat with many names ) survived the Last Ice Age of the Pleistocene, along with the grey wolf, black bear, and grizzly when a rather large number of big cats went extinct. You gotta hand it to the little guy; he adapts to change and has proven to be an excellent survivor. Ok, lets handed to the puma. But against bears.....lose.
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Post by brobear on Feb 23, 2019 13:10:34 GMT -5
shaggygod.proboards.com/ Grizzly Bears view cougars as "Feline Gravy Train" "Cougars, however, generally give the bears a wide berth. Grizzlies have less competition with cougars than with other predators such as coyotes, wolves, and other bears. When a grizzly descends on a cougar feeding on its kill, the cougar usually gives way to the bear. When a cougar does stand its ground, the cougar will use its superior agility and its claws to harass the bear yet stay out of its reach until one of them gives up, usually the cat." Though grizzlies likely kill few cougars, they may see the cats as a feline gravy train. Between 1990 and 1995, wildlife biologist Kerry Murphy and other HWI researchers monitored 113 cougar kills (mostly deer and elk) in Glacier and Yellowstone and discovered that bears (grizzlies and blacks) were claiming a significant share of the spoils. Bruins visited about one of every four cougar kills, robbing the feline owner of as much as 26 percent of its food requirement, sometimes for several days running. "It appears," says Murphy, "that competition for kills creates significant gains for bears and significant losses for cougars." "Grizzly and Black bear visited 24% of cougar kills in GNP and YNP and displaced cougars from their kill 10% of carcasses. Bears gained up to 113% and cougars lost 26 % of their respective daily requirements from these encounters. Bear predation and incomplete consumption of carcasses (especially salmon) provide food for a variety of scavengers." COSEWIC: Assessment and Update Status Report of the Grizzly Bear Ursus arctos in Canada dsp-psd.pwgsc.gc.ca/Collection/CW69-14-166-2002E.pdf
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Post by King Kodiak on Feb 23, 2019 13:24:07 GMT -5
This is becoming a Kleptoparasite thread brobear. Cougars hunt-bears take.
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Post by brobear on Mar 21, 2019 6:56:42 GMT -5
Cougar vs Grizzly is absurd, but the topic comes up... brought on by juvenile big cat fan-boys.
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Post by King Kodiak on Mar 21, 2019 7:07:30 GMT -5
GRIZZLY BEAR CUB MAKES FULL GROWN MOTHER COUGAR RETREAT.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2019 7:09:36 GMT -5
As powerful as a puma is, I highly doubt it can bring down a male black bear let alone a female black bear.
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Post by King Kodiak on Mar 21, 2019 7:18:29 GMT -5
BLACK BEAR DEFEATS PUMA AND MAKES HIM RUN AWAY.
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Post by King Kodiak on Mar 21, 2019 7:23:53 GMT -5
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